CAN I JUST SAY HOW REFRESHING IT IS FOR JOHN TO BE CALLING CALIBORN OUT ON HIS MISOGYNISTIC BULLSHIT
caliborn is such a weird fucking creep ugh
You realize this is really out of character, and Hussie is doing this to bump up his self image, and its working, right?
hussie specifically making a blatantly misogynistic character for no real good reason other than to make that an attribute of the villain (which is suuuuch a tired character trait uuuugh) and having another character say something that contradicts his typically oblivious and aloof personality throws off the storyline (if homestuck can even qualify for having one) and serves only as instant gratification from the fans to the white male author, and totally renders the point he supposedly was trying to make moot because instead of actually shedding light on the frequency of objectification and invalidation of female characters in media now he’s getting credit for being some great open minded anti-misogynistic guy! y’know, despite the fact he created a super misogynistic character for no real reason other than to perpetuate popular media that contains misogynistic characters and elements? y’know, the average viewer who is unaware and uneducated on rampant misogyny is just going to take caliborn’s behavior as normal, hussie isn’t being some brave and progressive author here.
this is a ploy, i basically just repeated everything nicolette said but yeah im really bothered by this
THIS FUCKING THANK U
Ahh. Tumblr saves the day again. This site literally can’t figure out what it wants. Not saying anything about how caliborn is creepy makes you bad, but then saying something about it makes him also bad? What do you guys want :I
All right, I was going to not reply to that, but I really need to address this.
Jail Break, Bard Quest, and Problem Sleuth aside (which are an entirely different argument that is also less relevant because clearly Hussie has learned a lesson or two since then - oh wow people changing what a novel idea) let me talk to you about a few things:
1. The feminism of Homestuck
2. Why it makes sense in-universe that Caliborn is sexist
3. Some parts of your arguments that I didn’t understand or feel the need to correct you on (This will be mostly covered by #s 1 and 2 but this is just to make sure I am absolutely crystal clear on this)
Ok so to preface this let me make a few things clear.
I am a queer white middle-class cis girl. Feminism is something I am very passionate about. You can check out my tagged/sexism and tagged/feminism pages if you want.
We could talk about cissexism in Homestuck for a long while, but that is not what I am addressing. I am addressing the above arguments, so I will mostly be staying inside the realm of feminism as applied to gender as thought of as a binary concept, which sucks, but considering there are no non-binary characters in Homestuck I can’t really think of how to apply this there. That would be an accurate argument against Homestuck or Andrew Hussie, but you didn’t mention it, so there you go.
Back to my point.
“You realize this is really out of character, and Hussie is doing this to bump up his self image, and its working, right?”
What’s out of character? I think you meant John standing up to sexism is out of character? Actually, since your rant seems more aimed at Hussie than Homestuck, I think you mean that it is out of character for Hussie to point out sexism and/or have something construed as feminism in one of his works.
Let me tell you why Homestuck is pretty feminist.
There is a (almost) perfect balance of characters of the two binary sexes, which is something some fans would kill to see in their other fandoms.
Not only are there so many female characters, those characters each display a variety of strengths and weaknesses that make them believable characters.
Many of the most badass characters in Homestuck are girls. The cycle of revenge between Terezi Pyrope, Vriska Serket, and Aradia Megido revolves on its own, with the only involvement of a male character being mind-controlling Tavros as a pawn to wake Terezi’s lusus. Have you seen [S] Make Her Pay and [S] Wake?
Can we go back to Terezi, the smartest of the trolls, who doesn’t need fancy psychic powers to manipulate her peers to her advantage?
Can we talk about Vriska Serket, the most developed and complex character in Homestuck (which is saying something, considering how many characters there are)?
Can we talk about Rose Lalonde blowing up her gate and giving an unstoppable demon a run for his money? Can we talk about the only three characters who stood a chance against said demon were all girls? How the only one who could be called an equal to said demon is one of those three?
Can we talk about how Rose is both silly and mature, gifted with great foresight yet prone to poor judgements, and fiercely loyal and caring?
Can we talk about Kanaya Fucking Maryam, the vampire fashion queen who slices Eridan in half for killing both her and Feferi? Or how about the same Kanaya Maryam, who speaks eloquently to the point of sesquipedalian loquaciousness?
Oh yes, there are queer girls. There are queer girls all around. Most trolls are bi, the only known exception being Kanaya, who is lesbian. Rose is in a relationship with Kanaya, but none of the rest of the characters bat an eye. That’s simply another thing about them, not a defining character trait, because being a girl who likes another girl does not make either of those characters a sexual object in Homestuck.
Can we talk about Jade Harley, who turned [S] Cascade into [S] Homestuck Fandom: Watch Jade Save Everyone’s Asses?
Can we talk about The Dolorosa, who gave up everything to protect her son, or The Disciple, who traveled the world in exile to spread hope to all, even though she was heartbroken at the death of her true love?
Can we talk about the rivalry of Mindfang and Redglare? The incomparable powers of The Handmaid and The Condesce?
What about Meenah? Aranea? Porrim, the sex-positive feminist who is portrayed as a much better character than Kankri, the social justice blogger who doesn’t believe in sexism?
HOW ABOUT ROXY FUCKING LALONDE, the dark horse leader of the alpha session, who has so much character development it hurts? Or Jane, the official leader of that session, one of the most relatable characters in the whole comic?
What about Calliope, the kindest character in Homestuck? The character who symbolizes the Homestuck fandom? The only one capable of stopping Lord English/Caliborn/Her brother?
Which brings me to my next point, which the second speaker seemed to harp on.
“hussie specifically making a blatantly misogynistic character for no real good reason other than to make that an attribute of the villain”
“the fact he created a super misogynistic character for no real reason other than to perpetuate popular media that contains misogynistic characters and elements? y’know, the average viewer who is unaware and uneducated on rampant misogyny is just going to take caliborn’s behavior as normal, hussie isn’t being some brave and progressive author here.”
If you actually read and paid attention to Homestuck at all, you would realize that it makes perfect sense for Caliborn to be sexist. All you need is basic knowledge of cherub culture.
Caliborn grew up hating his sister. To him, anything related to her was the antithesis of anything desirable, and anything related to him was the epitome of what everyone should strive for.
Yet, at the same time, cherubs seek their other half for a mate. Sburb is for players right at the cusp of sexual maturity. All cherubs seek another cherub with the characteristics of their other half - opposite sex, opposite temperament.
This contradiction of loathing and desire, in the extremes that characterize everything he does, is what makes Caliborn sexist.
It’s also what has driven sexism in this society, though the loathing is coser to derision. Still.
Everything about Caliborn’s character and background suggests that he should be sexist.
Also, I would like to meet the person who would see Caliborn’s behavior as “normal.”
Besides, the speaker keeps writing under the assumption that this very panel in which the protagonist calls out the antagonist on his bullshit is not precisely what the speaker seems to be simultaneously complaining about existing and complaining about not existing.
Ok, one more thing I’d like to address:
"…serves only as instant gratification from the fans to the white male author, and totally renders the point he supposedly was trying to make moot because instead of actually shedding light on the frequency of objectification and invalidation of female characters in media now he’s getting credit for being some great open minded anti-misogynistic guy!”
1. This phrase, “instant gratification,” I do not think it means what you think it means.
2. Is him being white is so relevant to this argument? Is this trying to argue that he is privileged and should check his privilege? That’s certainly an admirable argument, one I would back the speaker on. But it wasn’t really clear what they meant. It seems more like the speaker threw in the phrase “white male” as if it somehow discredited him from ever doing anything not bigoted.
3. Actually, “shedding light on the frequency of objectification and invalidation of female characters in media” is exactly what this is doing. That is quite obviously what is taking place here. You could take John’s statements word-for-word and say them to a movie producer or an author and it would mean the same thing:
"Why don’t you learn to respect girls better?! You’re just making them follow [male protagonist] around like a bunch of idiots! The only thing you’re letting them do is kiss the boy whenever he does something brave! That’s so lame! All these girls had their own cool adventures! Don’t you realize what you’re doing here makes you a weird creep???"
If that isn’t directly addressing the patriarchal media, I don’t know what is.
I’m very curious as to what the speaker meant by any of that.
I could talk to anyone about a host of other issues that Homestuck has.
Don’t ever let me catch anyone calling it sexist again.